Chatting with Fr. James Martin

Last updated on: March 4, 2017 at 2:17 am by Elizabeth Scalia

Chatting with Fr. James Martin 2017-03-04T02:17:52+00:00 Elizabeth Scalia

LOGO Patheos Explore the world's faith through different perspectives on religion and spirituality! Patheos has the views of the prevalent religions and spiritualities of the world.

I love his latest book, Between Heaven and Mirth almost as much as I loved My Life With the Saints (which is to say, a lot) but “Mirth” strikes me as a particularly great Christmas gift, because what heavy-lifting it requires comes with a ready-hand of diversionary wit and humor.

It is not scary. You can give it to someone who already has faith — any faith; the book does not speak exclusively to Catholics — and they will enjoy it immensely. You can give it to someone who doesn’t have faith, but has a sense of humor, and he or she will equally enjoy it, without feeling like you’re getting all pushy-and-proselytizing. And, having encountered religion laced with a bit of humor and humanity — which was, incidentally, how the saints often served it up — your giftees may be more amenable to future conversations exploring issues from a faith-perspective.

That’s always a good thing.

Best of all, you can give it to a generally agreeable sort who nevertheless thinks religion is a downer, or who is mushy in their faith, and who knows how the Holy Spirit may take over?

Since the Patheos Book Club will begin December by celebrating and discussing Between Heaven and Mirth, I’m very happy to be kicking it off by featuring a quick, chatty interview with Father Jim:

So, Between Heaven and Mirth is not exactly a pie in the face, but it reminds us—as did Chesterton—that “angels fly because they take themselves lightly.” Does that mean people have to be happy all the time, or they’re earthbound?

Not at all. One point I make in the book several times in the book is that being joyful does not mean being happy all the time. Sadness is a natural and human—and healthy—response to suffering or tragedy. You would be a robot if you weren’t sad from time to time. It’s an indication of emotional health actually.

But overall faith should lead to joy, because joy is happiness in God. Happiness is an emotion about what life gives you; joy is deeper, for it comes from a relationship with God. So you can live a joyful life and still move between happiness and sadness.

I’m not arguing that we should be grinning idiots 24/7 but that too much in our understanding of religion says that we need to be unsmiling and serious. And I think that some of this, as I say in the book, comes from an overemphasis on Jesus as the “Man of Sorrows.” He was a “Man of Joys,” too.

On the surface, this book would appear to be feather-light reading—it contains a number of very funny jokes and humorous anecdotes—and yet it presents some very deep lessons. I was surprised at how often, while reading, I was moved to sincere prayer. But if the Holy Spirit moves on the air, it should not surprise us that laughter can lead us to prayer.

It shouldn’t but it does! We’re so used to thinking of prayer as serious—not simply in the sense of serious-important but serious-somber—that your observation can seem shocking. The other day someone asked, “How am I supposed to be contemplative if I’m not serious?” And I thought that this was a fascinating question, because it revealed the person’s conflation of contemplation with an overriding seriousness. So I said, “Well, have you ever contemplated God’s creation on a beach or in a sunrise?”

When he nodded, I said, “And were you doing it with a frown on your face?” We both laughed!

There is, you say, both the “good” laughter, which is joyful, warm and self-aware, and then there is the “bad” laughter, which is ungenerous and involves laughing at others—mockery and jeering, and such. Is there an idea worth exploring here, of good laughter opening us up—physically, emotionally and spiritual—to good influences and bad laughter doing the opposite?

That’s an interesting question. Good laughter definitely opens us up—physically (by releasing endorphins); emotionally (by lightening our spirits) and spiritually (but enabling us to share in a God-given gift). And yes, bad laughter would do something of the opposite—it closes us down to other people, it moves us further away from God and it belittles someone. It’s sinful, I believe.

Do read the whole interview here, and as ever, with the book club, you will be able to read a free excerpt here, and overviews, reviews, roundtable bits, discussion questions and more, over the course of the next two weeks. Look for give-aways and Twitter discussion groups in the coming days, as well!

Previous Post

December 1, 2011

O, Come! O, Come!

Next Post

December 1, 2011 Book Recommendations for Christmas! UPDATED

Browse Our Archives

Select a Category "Remaking" Ourselves 'Remaking' America 9/10 Mindset 9/11 trials Abortion ACORN Adoration Advent Advent 2008 Advent 2009 Advent 2010 Alternative Energy Alternative Media America American Catholic Church American Church American Genius Ameridolatry ANCHORESS BOOKSHELF Anglican-Roman Reconciliation Answers & Questions Anti_Semitism Archbishop Hilarion Ayn Rand Bad Mass Barack Obama Baseball Benedict Benedict & Islam Benedict in UK Benedict XVI Benedictine Bill Whittle Birth Control Blogs and Blogging Blogs and Blogging Bloodless Coup Bobby Jindal Bookchat Breitbart Bride at every wedding... Bride at every wedding... Buckley Bullies Bush Bad? Bush Good Buster Capitalism Catholic Fiction Catholic Vocations Catholicism Celibacy Chaput Charitable Stuff Chesterton Chile Chris Christie Christians in Exile Christine O' Donnell Christmas Christmas Gift Ideas Church Hates Science? Church hates women Communion of Saints Compline Conclave 2013 Confession Constitutional Stuff Conversion Crisis & Opportunity Critical Thinking Crooks and Liars Crucible of Faith Cuba Culture of Life Culture of Life/Death Culture of Treason? Dancing Death Dialogue re Islam Dick Meyer Divorce and Remarriage DOJ Domestic Terrorism Dominican Order Don't try me too high Dowd Dumb Democrat moves Dumb GOP moves Economic woe Education Egregious Harry Reid Elder Son Elder Son's Sweet Girlfriend Elderly Election '10 Election '12 Election '16 Election 2004 Election 2006 Election 2008 Election 2010 Election 2016 Elena Kagan Elitism Embryonic Stem Cell Research End Times? English language Enhanced Interrogation Erosion of Rights Eucharist Euthanasia Exorcism Extraordinary Synod Facebook Faith Faith and Reason Faith Friday Faith Perspective Faithful Friday Fascism Again Fascism in America Fatima FCC Feminism Film First Things Forgiveness Fr. James Martin Francis and Islam Francis in America Frassati Fred Thompson Free Speech? Freedom of Worship FutureChurch Global Pandemic GOP Congress Haiti Head Covering Health Care Here and Queer Hermits Heroes Hitchens Holy Spirit Holy Week '09 Holy Week '10 Hoo-Hah & BS Hoo-Hah & BS Icons Illegal Immigration In The Arena Interviews Interwebz Iran Uprising Iraqi Christians ISIL ISIS Islamic State Islamification/Islamofascism Islamification/Islamofascism Isra-El It's all about me! Me! ME! James Burke Jerry Lewis Jesus Christ Joblessness John Boehner John McCain John Paul II John XXIII Juan Williams Just Words Katrina/Rita King is a Fink Latin Mass Leadership Lectio Divina Lent Lent '08 Lent '09 Lent 2010 Lent 2011 Limbaugh Listen to Lizzie Litigious Society Liturgy Liturgy of the Hours Mainstream Media Manliness Marriage Mary Media Excess Medical Merton Michelle Obama Mighty John O' Connor Misc. Miss Ella Missionaries Mitt Romney Monasticism My brother S My Irish Aunties Mystic Monks Nanny Statism Nature NEA Neri New Media Newman Noonan Notre Dame NPR Stuff Nun News Obama Bad? Obama Good? Obama White House Oil Spill Online Retreat '08 Online Retreat Days Oratory Orthodoxy Our Hillary! Parenting Passionists Patheos Patheos Book Club Patrons Paul Ryan Penance Penn Jillette Philosophy PJTV Podcasts Poetry Politics-free zone Pop Culture Pope Emeritus Pope Francis Prayer Predictions Priesthood Pro-Life Public Sector Unions Purgatory Questions about Catholicism Quotes of the Day Quoting the News Race in America rants Recipes Remarried Catholics Reposts by request Retreat thoughts Rome Rudy Giuliani Russia Saints Sarah Palin Scandal Scott Brown SCOTUS Scriptural stuff Secularism Send in the clowns Serving up hot links Sexuality Sherrod Shroud of Turin Sisters and Nuns Social Entrepreneurship Social Media Social Security Socialism doesn't work Sports and Faith Stem Cells Strange Gods Suffering Synod Tea Parties Tea Party Terri Schiavo The 9/11 Commission The Catholic Answer The Constitution The Desert The Fourth Estate The Pelosi The Perpetual Adolescents The Rosary Third Party? Timothy Dolan Touch of evil TSA Tsunami TV/Pop Culture/Music TV/Pop Culture/Music Twitter Uncategorized Unemployment Unintended Consequences US Military Vaginal Musings Vatican Vespers video faves Vile Joe Biden Voter Fraud War by Litigation War on Terror War, What it good for? Why can't weeee be ... World Youth Days Year of Faith Year of the Priest

Select a Month August 2016 July 2016 April 2016 March 2016 January 2016 December 2015 November 2015 October 2015 September 2015 August 2015 July 2015 June 2015 May 2015 April 2015 March 2015 February 2015 January 2015 December 2014 November 2014 October 2014 September 2014 August 2014 July 2014 June 2014 May 2014 April 2014 March 2014 February 2014 January 2014 December 2013 November 2013 October 2013 September 2013 August 2013 July 2013 June 2013 May 2013 April 2013 March 2013 February 2013 January 2013 December 2012 November 2012 October 2012 September 2012 August 2012 July 2012 June 2012 May 2012 April 2012 March 2012 February 2012 January 2012 December 2011 November 2011 October 2011 September 2011 August 2011 July 2011 June 2011 May 2011 April 2011 March 2011 February 2011 January 2011 December 2010 November 2010 October 2010 September 2010 August 2010 July 2010 June 2010 May 2010 April 2010 March 2010 February 2010 January 2010 December 2009 November 2009 October 2009 September 2009 August 2009 July 2009 June 2009 May 2009 April 2009 March 2009 February 2009 January 2009 December 2008 November 2008 October 2008 September 2008 August 2008 July 2008 June 2008 May 2008 April 2008 March 2008 February 2008 January 2008 November 2007 October 2007 September 2007 August 2007 July 2007 June 2007 May 2007 March 2007 February 2007 January 2007 December 2006 November 2006 October 2006 September 2006 August 2006 July 2006 June 2006 May 2006 April 2006 March 2006 February 2006 January 2006 December 2005 November 2005 September 2005 August 2005 July 2005 June 2005 May 2005 April 2005 March 2005 February 2005 January 2005 December 2004 November 2004 October 2004 August 2004

TAKE THE

Religious Wisdom Quiz

How many times did Elijah stretch over dead child?

Select your answer to see how you score.

3 5 4 2