Comments on “She says this is my problem, not hers…”

Last updated on: September 17, 2009 at 10:31 am by Natasha Helfer

Comments on “She says this is my problem, not hers…” 2009-09-17T10:31:00-05:00 Natasha Helfer

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I received a lot of comments on the following post: She says this is my problem, not hers….

And I’d like to address them all at once if possible.

That “affair with yourself” suggestion scares the living daylights out of me. It sounds so wrong, somehow. It seems like anyone who gave themselves permission to be selfish for 6 months to a year would be giving in to the natural man and would enjoy it and choose that path. Eternal marriage isn’t easy. But it’s a commandment and something that can make us grow in ways that nothing else can. I think turning to yourself that much is like giving up on your side of the triangle. Only God is holding it together, but He has given us agency, and if two have turned away from each other, it won’t take long for it to break. Instead, I would say he should turn further to God and really work on the relationship there. That will strengthen the triangle.

I am not a mental health professional, but despite my lack of expertise I want to express my opinion that I do not necessarily agree with the suggestion that a priesthood leader explain to the wife the proper functioning of sex within marriage (unless the wife has a true doctrinal question about this). Whether the woman’s withdrawal is a result of stresses in the marriage, her abusive father, disappointment with her husband, or some other source, I don’t think that it would be healthy to have a male ecclesiastical leader, usually untrained as a family therapist, telling her that she should be giving herself physically to her husband.
Further, it seems that much of the advice seems to overlook the possibility that the husband could effect some positive changes in the marriage even if his wife is not ready to confront issues together. Perhaps the husband has many blind spots that have contributed more than he realizes to his wife’s withdrawal. A good individual therapist could help him confront these issues. I don’t think that considering ultimatums is necessarily the next step.
Based on my own experiences, I would be inclined to view the wife’s insistence that the problem is her husband’s alone as a signal that the wife has been very hurt by her husband but does not feel safe talking about it.

I disagree with both previous commenters here. I am not an expert per se, but having lived in a similar relationship for well over 10 years, I see the wisdom and value in the counsel that was given.
First, in my opinion, the suggestion to have “an affair with yourself” did not exclude the possibility that part of this affair would in fact be a strengthening of the husband’s relationship with God. I understood the suggestion to be merely to take a step back from the marriage and to find other interests to create fulfillment. It is unfortunate that our marriages can become so imbalanced at times, and the desire to restore some equilibrium easily becomes all consuming: the more one spouse tries, the more the other resists. The spouse that is dissatisfied with the relationship becomes so emotionally spent that it is wise for this spouse to find other areas of fulfillment, including strengthening the relationship with God.
Second, although a priesthood leader may not be the ideal person, in these cases where no progress is being made after multiple attempts over a period of time, the opinion of a neutral third party can be invaluable. Where the wife has refused counseling, the options for a neutral third party become somewhat limited.
Of course, I do not know either person in this relationship, so I could be completely off . . . .

I think the variety of comments here reflects a key truth — ultimately, the only one who can guide this person is God. There is no one right answer for these kinds of challenges. relationships are so complex. I would urge the person writing in to pray and seek for answers about next steps.
Do I step back?
Do I let go of expectations and just support my wife in what she is obviously struggling with?
Do I confront her?
Do I insist that she do something or else?
Do I let her be and do and just do my thing for a while?
Do I consider leaving?
Do I stay and just be grateful for the good that is there?
Do I just wait?
The possibilities are nearly boundless.
I think also that what is unacceptable in the ideal (no sex) may really need to be addressed from where this woman is. Maybe she is selfish and past feeling and it’s time to be done. or maybe she is in deep pain and her husband’s responses could help her and their marriage heal. I can’t help but wonder if it’s the latter. It must be so hard to have no intimacy, and to have her shut down, but have you prayed and prayed and prayed some more for insight on how to respond? If maybe the approach was less about your needs and hopes but more about trying to create a space where she might be able to feel more comfortable sharing over time??
The only way to know really is from God, imo.
I do agree, though, that hopelessness is not a good option, and while I’m not sure I would agree with going to a full emotional separation test yet (it sounds like there is still a lot so fresh, so new. seems that there could be lots there lurking beneath her surface that some compassion and time might open up?
I do think that it’s good to consider ways to be happy that are not tied to his wife’s decisions. Ultimately, whether he/she stays or leaves or whatever is not for anyone to decide. But regardless, he can make progress toward not being so dependent on what she chooses, whether the marriage continues or not. I can’t help but wonder if that dependence is part of what may be adding to the problem…more pressure for her, less feeling of safety and space and respect for her agency…even if you don’t agree with or like her choices. Again, maybe there is no hope for the marriage. But maybe there are things that God can help you know and see to do that could help open things up toward a process of healing.
I have seen this happen in situations that seemed hopeless. the spirit can do amazing things toward that end. If nothing else, he can heal your heart. Maybe if you have less pain and resentment so you can see more clearly what is really the right thing to do. If you are acting out of pain or anger, you will likely not make a good decision. your heart needs to be in a good place for the spirit to guide. If you are still angry, maybe start there?
Maybe. or maybe not. Again, only God can really help you figure it out.
It can be so hard, but that process in and of itself is a key part of why we are here, imo. Go to Him. like never before.

I realize that using the term “affair with yourself” could be deemed controversial and maybe I could have chosen better terminology. However, what scares the living daylights out of me is that this couple has not had sex for 9 years, are living in separate quarters, and are more than likely planning to leave each other as soon as the children are out of the house. In addition, I’m sure the tension, sadness and hopelessness in the home is having all kinds of effects on the children themselves as this example of non-existent intimacy is showcased. Although still officially married, there is little left of an emotional or spiritual relationship between these two individuals – not falling in lines with the definition of true marriage after all. Couples that find themselves in such negative and long-lasting patterns can in essence be entrenched and stuck – there are people who live an entire marriage like this. It is commendable that they stay together (usually out of religious reasons, financial reasons or for the sake of the children) but they stay miserable in the process. And there is no reason we should live out our lives miserably. When couples are stuck then they are continually relating in a way that exacerbates the problems – many times without even realizing it or meaning to (i.e. you yell to get someone’s attention and when they don’t hear you, you yell louder – but you’re still yelling instead of doing something completely different like flagging them down). So my suggestion to take a step back is in essence, trying something drastically different and new. This man is in the role of pursuer and his wife is the rejecter. It’s not working. Trying to get him to pursue her in different ways, will probably not work either at this point. If he can take a genuine step back from this role – there may be a new possibility. The key to doing this correctly is to not allow anger, bitterness and selfishness to be the motivating reasons – and that’s what makes this a difficult exercise. It’s hard for me to describe what I want him to be able to do in writing – this process usually takes a lot of coaching on the therapist’s part. But the goal is to back up from the negativity – sever the emotional ties (mostly negative at this point) – and hopefully from there start recreating the relationship. Hopefully, as an added plus, people can learn how to meet some of their own needs. Is there a risk that the marriage will not survive this process? Yes. But the risk already exists and greatly so. It’s like doing experimental medicine on people who have a terminal illness. Sometimes it works!

As far as talking with our bishops regarding sexual issues – it is sometimes the only place people feel comfortable to go. I get the feeling that this wife is using incorrect doctrinal interpretations to justify her position. The hardest part of doing this blog is that I only get one side of the story. So I’m doing the best I can with only half the information I usually need to be most successful. However, it is completely appropriate to discuss things of a sexual nature with our bishops and it is also completely appropriate for them to give guidance in this area of our lives. Will they be perfect at it? No. Are they professionally trained in these subjects? No. But this is where hopefully we can trust in the spiritual guidance they receive and in revelation. If someone has received sexual counsel from a bishop that they are uncomfortable with or has not been helpful, then I would encourage getting other opinions and discussing it. Further trauma is never the goal or intent in these situations. I would encourage people to get professional advice as well – but many in our Mormon culture are just not willing to do this – as in this case. And many minimize professional advice even when they get it because they don’t see it as “in accord” with gospel teachings even though this is many times not accurate.

I agree that the wife may not feel safe discussing the marital issues at hand – and there are more than likely legitimate reasons as to why she is struggling. However, “checking out” is not a long-term viable option. Not if a marriage is to succeed. It is just not fair to take the stance, “I’m not happy with you, I don’t want to have sex with you, I’m not going to tell you why I’m not happy, and I refuse to get help telling you why.” Regardless if it is a wife or a husband who is doing this, it just isn’t an appropriate way to act.

The word “ultimatum” is also controversial and I should have used instead “setting appropriate boundaries and expectations in an honest and open fashion.” Stating “I cannot continue in our marriage if we can’t resolve certain issues” is an appropriate statement. Stating “I will leave you if you don’t change!” is not.

As far as the staying close to God throughout this process, I completely agree that this is pivotal and very much a part of our personal journeys here on earth. Prayer, fasting, scripture study, meditation, journal writing, etc. etc. are all useful tools to help us do this.

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How can I change my perception to recognize my wife's love for me? Part II

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