Buddhist Catholic Contemplative Evangelical General Christian Hindu Jewish Latter-day Saint Muslim New Visions Progressive Christian

Beliefs

Topics

Columnists

Resource Library

Research Tools

Video

Podcasts

Thought Readers

Faith In Media Tracker

Newsletters

Ad-Free & Subscriber Log-In Subscription Support

Follow Patheos

Catholic and Enjoying It!

Home
Catholic
A Reader Tries to Square the MAGA/100% Catholic Circle, Part 1 of 3

A Reader Tries to Square the MAGA/100% Catholic Circle, Part 1 of 3

Last updated on: January 27, 2020 at 3:15 pm by Mark Shea

A Reader Tries to Square the MAGA/100% Catholic Circle, Part 1 of 3 2020-01-27T15:15:13-07:00 Mark Shea

LOGO Patheos Explore the world's faith through different perspectives on religion and spirituality! Patheos has the views of the prevalent religions and spiritualities of the world.

A reader writes:

Hey Mark: I Am a cradle to grave devout Roman Catholic. I agree 100% with everything that the Catholic church teaches. I assist at R.C.I.A. at my Parish. I also agree with everything President Trump is doing to protect us at the border. The Democrats want open borders and free health care for illegals.

You don’t agree with everything the Church teaches if you support Trump’s sadistic cruelty to people seeking asylum at the border, his policies of separating families, his abandonment of children to sexual abuse at the hands of ICE, his refusal to give them vaccination, and even the confiscation of rosaries and refusal to allow Christmas carols. And your refusal to even speak of them as human beings (“illegals”) does not indicate that you take seriously the Church’s teaching on the dignity of the human person.

You need to make up your mind: does the dignity of the human person come from God or the state?

If the former, then the legal status of “illegals” does not matter in the slightest when it comes to saving their lives and protecting their human dignity. So the ICE policies of destruction of water supplies and denial of flu vaccines are crimes against God because they are intended to kill people.

If from the state, then you support Roe and abortion and are not obeying the Church. Either way, you do not persuade me that you agree “100%” with everything the Church teaches.

The democrats don’t care about the human dignity of illegals coming into our country. All they care about is their votes.

I don’t have the slightest interest what motivates Democrats. I care what the Church teaches. That it matters more to you who “illegals” vote for than whether they live or die again does not suggest to me that you really are “100%” invested in the Church’s teaching. If a Democrat wants to give refugees dying of thirst water and you do not, who do you think Jesus says was neighbor to that refugee? See the Parable of the Good Samaritan for further information. (Oh, and by the way, document for me that Democrats wants “open borders”, because I am aware of nobody but brainwashed viewers of FOX who say this. Show me the evidence. Show me the quotes. Let me see a single Democrat leader calling for “open borders”, much less all of them. One thing the Church teaches is, “You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.”)

Democrat policy not only would over run our hospitals it would destroy our country.

Congratulations on your sudden degree in Health Administration. Where did you get your expertise? I myself know nothing about it. Where are the Dems calling for total free health care for all “illegals”? How many do they mean? I would think the real problem is the people who are trying to make health care as expensive and inaccessible as possible for you and me, not people trying to give out flu shots to a few desperate refugees. But then I’m just going by what the Church says when she urges us to help the stranger and care for the sick.

The United States CANNOT take care of the whole world.

And if any Dem was saying that, you’d really have a point. But since no Dem is, I don’t know what you are talking about. Jesus said to care for the sick and the stranger. So does the Church. If you want to complain about that, you’ll need to walk back that 100% thing.

BTW: I work for my dad in the trucking business. After the election my dad told me that if Hillary Clinton had won the election he was going to sell his business. I would have been looking for a job in the Hillary Clinton/obama job killing economy.

You get that it was Cheney’s “Deficits don’t matter” and Bush’s incompetence that brought on the Recession, right? And that Obama’s economy is what saved us from that and grew the economy better than Trump’s incompetence has done in three years? Not that this really matters except to illustrate that, yet again, what you are telling me is that what really matters in your argument is Mammon, not the Church’s teaching. Clinton was not going to do anything special to hurt the economy and Trump has done nothing special to help it. He has helped the 1% and screwed the middle class and, above all, those affected by his idiot tariffs**.**

But most importantly, he has deeply corrupted American conservative Christians into the most seduced apologists in the Church for every lie, crime, cruelty, and selfishness he commits. I could fill pages with documentation of the torrent of lies and sins conservative Christians have, of their own free will, chosen to embrace and cheer for, all while claiming “100%” adherence to the Church. It is an appalling witness and some day the MAGA Cult will stand before God and answer for it all. I hope they have repented by then.

***
Email #2 from my reader, in which we focus on the real thing my reader cares about–money–and brandish the unborn as human shields:

Shea: You want to talk about jobs. You don’t know you are talking about. obama told us those manufacturing jobs are never coming back. Under obama we LOST 200,000 manufacturing jobs. Under President Trump we have already added over 400,000 jobs.

Here is a PARTIAL list of President Trumps accomplishments.

According to Father Pavone President Trump is the most prolife President We have ever had. Father Pavone is the National director for Priest for LIFE.

The Democrat Party is the party of BUTCHERING BABIES.

Father Pavone (Prolife Catholic Priest)

https://www.lifesitenews.com/news/watch-fr.-pavone-defends-covington-boys-trump-hats-support-of-pro-life-pres

I tell one thing. I would NOT want to be a Catholic priest that votes for a political candidate that supports abortion rights.

I don’t think Jesus would vote for a politician that endorses/supports abortion.

If you want to vote for abortionists that is your business.

My name is Mark. I oppose abortion. I always have. Because I have gotten the “but abortion!” reply a million times as the rationale for supporting Trump’s sadistic cruelty. Here is my cut and paste reply:

For the periodic Inquisitor who shows up to tell me I am “excommunicate” and “guilty of genocide” for voting Dem.

There are two parties. One is 100% responsible for the establishment (with ROE) and entrenchment (with CASEY) of abortion. That same party has done nothing to overturn these decisions and, just this month, approved (for the 10th time at least since Trump’s inauguration) funding Planning Parenthood (this time for $550 million). Last year, Trump and his party of con men conned you by raising the funding for Planned Parenthood 8%.

The other party is the Democrats.

There is no pro-life party. There is the party that supports Roe and Casey and every sadistic cruelty of the Cult of Trump (as well as pursuing policies that spike the demand for abortion) and there is the party that supports Roe and pursues policies that lower the demand for abortion. There is the party that constitutes the gravest threat to our Constitutional order since the Civil War–the GOP–and then there is the party doing their best to defend our country from them–the Dems. Consequently, I not only feel free to vote for them, I feel bound before Almighty God in conscience to do so.

When the Holy Father tells me I’m excommunicate, then I’ll listen, not when some ignorant spouting popinjay in a combox says so. The “prolife” Cult of Trump does not care about abortion in the least. They care about using the unborn as human shields for all the lies, crime, cruelty, and sadism that they are actually interested in defending. And since B16 has already said that it is legit to vote to lessen evil (not to support the lesser evil)–

“A Catholic would be guilty of formal cooperation in evil, and so unworthy to present himself for Holy Communion, if he were to deliberately vote for a candidate precisely because of the candidate’s permissive stand on abortion and/or euthanasia. When a Catholic does not share a candidate’s stand in favour of abortion and/or euthanasia, but votes for that candidate for other reasons, it is considered remote material cooperation, which can be permitted in the presence of proportionate reasons.”

–I could not possibly care less what some total stranger says about the alleged state of my soul for doing what my conscience demands. Here: read and learn. Oh, and after Frank Pavone’s disgraceful and unapologetic desecration of an altar in order to do a stump speech for Trump, I am not interested in the views of a grifter who will not let his superiors see his books and who is not a priest in good standing with his bishop. Especially, after this weird performance that even turned off Traditionalist Eric Sammons, a writer for Catholic Vote:

Fr. Frank Pavone calls his critics “the stupidest enemies in the world,” denies being penalized as a priest, and claims “the church is behind our work.” pic.twitter.com/WUFINEcp6S

— Dan (@CatholicSkeptic) January 7, 2020

Image may contain: 1 person, smiling, possible text that says 'Eric Sammons @EricRSammons Possibly unpopular opinion (at least to members of my "tribe"): Fr. Frank Pavone is not a good representative of a Catholic priest. From his questionable canonical status to his unreserved devotion to Trump to his childish attacks on his opponents, he comes across as unhinged.'

***

Email #3, more “If you don’t support Trump, you are a BABYKILLER” rubbish:

Mark: Like I said. If you want to vote for butchering babies go for it. I am voting prolife.

You did not read a word I wrote. So there’s no point in continuing to pretend you want a conversation. Meanwhile, be aware that you do not believe 100% of what the Church teaches and you are only interested in the unborn as human shields for the anti-Catholic policies you really care about. I’m not sure why you thought you needed to write me. I hope what I wrote you sticks in your conscience and brings you to confront the Holy Spirit and what he is actually teaching you through the Church. Support for Trump cannot be squared with the Church’s teaching. What you in fact end up doing is defending a host of lies, cruelties, crimes, and evils, not the unborn.

More tomorrow…

Uncategorized

Mailbag

Previous Post

January 25, 2020

VELOCIPASTOR!

Next Post

January 28, 2020 A Reader Tries to Square the MAGA/100% Catholic Circle, Part 2 of 3

Browse Our Archives

Select a Category Uncategorized

Select a Month May 2020 April 2020 March 2020 February 2020 January 2020 December 2019 November 2019 October 2019 September 2019 August 2019 July 2019 June 2019 May 2019 April 2019 March 2019 February 2019 January 2019 December 2018 November 2018 October 2018 September 2018 August 2018 July 2018 June 2018 May 2018 April 2018 March 2018 February 2018 January 2018 December 2017 November 2017 October 2017 September 2017 August 2017 July 2017 June 2017 May 2017 April 2017 March 2017 February 2017 January 2017 December 2016 November 2016 October 2016 September 2016 August 2016 July 2016 June 2016 May 2016 December 2015 November 2015 October 2015 September 2015 August 2015 July 2015 June 2015 May 2015 April 2015 March 2015 February 2015 January 2015 December 2014 November 2014 October 2014 September 2014 August 2014 July 2014 June 2014 May 2014 April 2014 March 2014 February 2014 January 2014 December 2013 November 2013 October 2013 September 2013 August 2013 July 2013 June 2013 May 2013 April 2013 March 2013 February 2013 January 2013 December 2012 November 2012 October 2012 September 2012 August 2012 July 2012 June 2012 May 2012 April 2012 March 2012 February 2012 January 2012 December 2011 November 2011 October 2011 September 2011 August 2011 July 2011 June 2011 May 2011 April 2011 March 2011 February 2011 January 2011 December 2010 November 2010 October 2010 September 2010 August 2010 July 2010 June 2010 May 2010 April 2010 March 2010 February 2010 January 2010 December 2009 November 2009 October 2009 September 2009 August 2009 July 2009 June 2009 May 2009 April 2009 March 2009 February 2009 January 2009 September 2006 June 2006 July 2005 April 2005 May 2002 April 2002 0000

TAKE THE

Religious Wisdom Quiz