BuddhistCatholicContemplativeEvangelicalGeneral ChristianHinduJewishLatter-day SaintMuslimNew VisionsProgressive Christian
Beliefs
- Buddhist
- Catholic
- Contemplative
- Evangelical
- General Christian
- Hindu
- Jewish
- Latter-day Saint
- More Voices
- Muslim
- New Visions
- Pagan
- Progressive Christian
Topics
- Religion News
- Food and Religion
- Sports and Religion
- Religious Art
- Religious Music and Entertainment
- Religious Events
- History and Religion
- Style and Religion
- Politics and Religion
- Women in Religion
- Recreation Outdoors and Religion
- Business Finance and Religion
- Careers Workplace and Religion
- Education and Religion
- Family Parenting and Religion
- Health Fitness and Religion
- Home and Religion
- Relationships and Religion
- Technology and Religion
- Travel and Religion
Columnists
- Buddhist Columnists
- Business Finance and Religion Columnists
- Careers Workplace and Religion Columnists
- Catholic Columnists
- Contemplative Columnists
- Education and Religion Columnists
- Evangelists Columnists
- Family Parenting and Religion Columnists
- General Christian Columnists
- Health Fitness and Religion Columnists
- Hindu Columnists
- History and Religion Columnists
- Home and Religion Columnists
- Jewish Columnists
- More Voices Columnists
- Latter Day Columnists
- Muslim Columnists
- New Visions Columnists
- Nonreligious Columnists
- Pagan Columnists
- Politics and Religion Columnists
- Progressive Columnists
- Recreation Outdoors and Religion Columnists
- Relationships and Religion Columnists
- Religion News Columnists
- Religious Art Columnists
- Religious Events Columnists
- Religious Music and Entertainment Columnists
- Sports and Religion Columnists
- Style and Religion Columnists
- Technology and Religion Columnists
- Travel and Religion Columnists
- Women in Religion Columnists
Resource Library
- 2026 Calendar
- Library of World Religions
- The 100 Most Holy Places on Earth
- Patheos Answers
- Podcasts
- Videos
- Faith Leaders Database
- Anglican Episcopalian
- Bahai
- Baptist
- Buddhism
- Christianity
- Confucianism
- Eastern Orthodoxy
- Hinduism
- Holiness and Pentecostal
- ISKCON
- Islam
- Judaism
- Lutheran
- Methodist
- The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints
- New Age
- Paganism
- Presbytarian and Reformed
- Protestantism
- Religion Behind the Scenes
- Roman Catholic
- Scientology
- Shia Islam
- Sikhism
- Sufism
- Sunni Islam
- Taoism
- Zen
- See all religions
Research Tools
Ad-Free & Subscriber Log-In Subscription Support
Ad-Free & Subscriber Log-In Subscription Support
- Trending:
- Forgiveness
- |
- Marriage
- |
- Consciousness
- |
- Death Penalty
- |
- Election
- |
- Halloween
Love, Joy, Feminism
-
More
- Home
- Nonreligious
- To Train Up A Child: Soul Invasion
To Train Up A Child: Soul Invasion
Last updated on: May 3, 2018 at 8:22 am by Libby Anne
To Train Up A Child: Soul Invasion 2018-05-03T08:22:04-04:00 Libby Anne
Patheos Explore the world's faith through different perspectives on religion and spirituality! Patheos has the views of the prevalent religions and spiritualities of the world.
To Train Up A Child, chapter 21, part 5
Today we finish Michael’s conclusion—and the book. I may at some point try to draw up a post comprehensively critiquing the book’s main themes—with quotes—that people can point to as a basic primer. For now, though, Michael’s conclusion.
Reading back over the text, it seems that I have given a lot of negatives–what not to do, and what is wrong. If I were simply giving instruction for laying out a flower garden, it could all be quite positive; but if a surgeon is instructing student doctors on heart surgery, there will be a lot of negatives. A procedure so invasive requires cautious, narrow limitations with needful warnings. That which is successfully accomplished every day can end in tragedy if done negligently. Child rearing is an invasive procedure. You invade the soul of a developing human being, an eternal living soul. It is not an inconsequential procedure. The whole heavens stand in the waiting room in anticipation of the outcome.
Oh boy.
Child rearing is an invasive procedure.
You invade the soul of a developing human being.
I’m trying to figure out how to put into words what feels so off about this. Maybe it’s the word “invade,” which would seem to suggest forced entry. Maybe it’s the idea that we should get inside of our kids’s souls—whatever happened to privacy, or a little mental or emotional space? Maybe it’s that Michael says this in the same book where he advises parents to beat their children until they utter a “submissive whimper.” Is that part of the soul invasion he recommends?
I would use very different words. We teach our children. We guide them. We help them learn how to work through their emotions, how to center themselves, how to treat and interact with others, how to be effective consumers of technology and material goods. We don’t invade their souls. There is just something so creepy and off about that.
Because here’s the thing: When I was a child, my parents could control my behavior, but they did not control my internal life. That was mine. They might spank me for disobedience, they might send me to my room for having an “unpleasant attitude,” but they couldn’t control my thoughts or feelings. Those were mine. And that was important!
I may guide my daughter in how to manage her emotions and feelings—emotions can be big for little people!—but that is where it stops. Her emotions, her thoughts, her feelings—those are hers.
If after reading this you feel frustrated and discouraged, don’t attempt to implement the techniques taught herein. This is not something that can be TRIED or applied a little at a time. It takes insight and confidence to endure. If this is all new to you and you have some doubts, you will not make it through the trials. You should read it again and turn to additional sources of counsel.
On the other hand, if it is as if I have put into words the things you have known all along but never been able to articulate, and these concepts are in your heart, and you are totally convinced of the right of what we have said, then by God’s grace you will see results.
This whole “it takes insight and confidence to endure” bit—this whole you have to implement it whole package bit, you can’t just do it piece by people and by god you have to endure—this is what led to the death of Lydia Schatz. It’s a toxic attempt to short-circuit any feeling that something may be wrong. You set a line and your child will not give and you’ve been spanking them for hours and still they will not submit to your will? You can’t stop. That feeling like maybe you should stop beating this child, maybe whatever you’re trying to do isn’t working—suppress it and endure.
It’s cult-speak is what it is. It leaves no room for ifs and maybes and what ifs. It leaves no room for nuance, or for situations where it doesn’t work. It’s absolute. It’s unchanging. It’s unbending. It runs people over.
Let me close with the words of a four-year-old. A family who had been applying these truths for only a week was visiting us in our front yard. Preparing to leave, the father called their new dog. The excited dog teased the man by running off just as he got within reach. The father became irritable and started speaking critically of the dog’s intelligence. Pleading on behalf of the dog, the four-year-old son said, “But Daddy, you haven’t trained him yet!”
Pleading on behalf of the dog.
What exactly was the father saying about the dog’s intelligence?
I have a problem with the word “train” as applied to child rearing. I don’t train my children. I teach them. They’re going to be adults one day. Training them to jump when I say jump wouldn’t serve them at all, as adults. What skills, exactly, is Michael passing on with his methods?
The premises in this book are just so backwards. It makes me think of a scene in Michael Farris’ Forbid Them Not where a mother is ordered by the court not to spank her 9-year-old son, and suddenly has no way to get through to the child. And I’m reading this section thinking, he’s nine. If you can’t get through to a 9-year-old without spanking him, the problem isn’t that child. And yet, Farris clearly wrote that section thinking see, this is what happens when parents aren’t allowed to spank, like he he was proving some sort of point. Well he was—just not the one he thought he was.
The premise is broken.
I have a Patreon! Please support my writing!
Next Post

May 4, 2018 Forbid Them Not: A New Review Series!
Browse Our Archives
Select a Category Atheism Evangelicalism/Fundamentalism Family Feminism Homeschool Meta Parenting Patriarchy Politics Purity Quiverfull Social Justice Uncategorized Worthwhile reads
Select a Month February 2021 January 2021 December 2020 November 2020 October 2020 September 2020 August 2020 July 2020 June 2020 May 2020 April 2020 March 2020 February 2020 January 2020 December 2019 November 2019 October 2019 September 2019 August 2019 July 2019 June 2019 May 2019 April 2019 March 2019 February 2019 January 2019 December 2018 November 2018 October 2018 September 2018 August 2018 July 2018 June 2018 May 2018 April 2018 March 2018 February 2018 January 2018 December 2017 November 2017 October 2017 September 2017 August 2017 July 2017 June 2017 May 2017 April 2017 March 2017 February 2017 January 2017 December 2016 November 2016 October 2016 September 2016 August 2016 July 2016 June 2016 May 2016 April 2016 March 2016 February 2016 January 2016 December 2015 November 2015 October 2015 September 2015 August 2015 July 2015 June 2015 May 2015 April 2015 March 2015 February 2015 January 2015 December 2014 November 2014 October 2014 September 2014 August 2014 July 2014 June 2014 May 2014 April 2014 March 2014 February 2014 January 2014 December 2013 November 2013 October 2013 September 2013 August 2013 July 2013 June 2013 May 2013 April 2013 March 2013 February 2013 January 2013 December 2012 November 2012 October 2012 September 2012 August 2012 July 2012 June 2012 May 2012 April 2012 March 2012 February 2012 January 2012 December 2011 November 2011 October 2011 September 2011 August 2011 July 2011 June 2011
Follow Us!
TAKE THE
Religious Wisdom Quiz
In James, what is the correct sequence that leads from temptation to death?
Select your answer to see how you score.
Desire, sin conceived, sin full-grown, death Desire, temptation, sin, death Sin, desire, full-grown sin, death Temptation, desire, death, judgment
Related posts from Love, Joy, Feminism
TTUAC: In Which Michael Deals in Dysfunctional Relationships
To Train Up A Child: Toys? What Toys?
TTUAC: Life without Struggle Has No Achievement
TRENDING AT PATHEOS Nonreligious
Dethroning Jesus and Enthroning Yourself
Jesus Never Asked to Be Worshipped. He Asked to Be Understood. Christianity...
Why Most Christians are Really Paulians and Jobians
I Don't Care, But It Matters Let's get this out of the...
Essential Tips to Successfully Navigate the Selling Process
Selling a house can feel overwhelming, but it doesn’t have to be....
To Make Remote Work Effective, Think About Others
The COVID-19 pandemic forced many companies to rapidly transition to remote work....
Flexibility Is Key to Solving Problems of Tomorrow
The world of work is undergoing a dramatic transformation. The COVID-19 pandemic...
view all Nonreligious blogs
Ad-Free & Subscriber Log-In Subscription Support
- About Us
- 2026 Calendar
- Videos
- Podcasts
- Library of World Religions
- Faith In Media Tracker
- Advertise With Us
- Write for Us
- Privacy Policy
- Terms of Service
- Do Not Sell My Data
- Contact Us
- Radiant Digital
- Manage Newsletter Subscriptions
- Unsubscribe From Notifications
- Sitemap
Copyright 2008-2026, Patheos. All rights reserved.
Subscription Support Ad-Free & Subscriber Log-In










