BuddhistCatholicContemplativeEvangelicalGeneral ChristianHinduJewishLatter-day SaintMuslimNew VisionsProgressive Christian
Beliefs
- Buddhist
- Catholic
- Contemplative
- Evangelical
- General Christian
- Hindu
- Jewish
- Latter-day Saint
- More Voices
- Muslim
- New Visions
- Pagan
- Progressive Christian
Topics
- Religion News
- Food and Religion
- Sports and Religion
- Religious Art
- Religious Music and Entertainment
- Religious Events
- History and Religion
- Style and Religion
- Politics and Religion
- Women in Religion
- Recreation Outdoors and Religion
- Business Finance and Religion
- Careers Workplace and Religion
- Education and Religion
- Family Parenting and Religion
- Health Fitness and Religion
- Home and Religion
- Relationships and Religion
- Technology and Religion
- Travel and Religion
Columnists
- Buddhist Columnists
- Business Finance and Religion Columnists
- Careers Workplace and Religion Columnists
- Catholic Columnists
- Contemplative Columnists
- Education and Religion Columnists
- Evangelists Columnists
- Family Parenting and Religion Columnists
- General Christian Columnists
- Health Fitness and Religion Columnists
- Hindu Columnists
- History and Religion Columnists
- Home and Religion Columnists
- Jewish Columnists
- More Voices Columnists
- Latter Day Columnists
- Muslim Columnists
- New Visions Columnists
- Nonreligious Columnists
- Pagan Columnists
- Politics and Religion Columnists
- Progressive Columnists
- Recreation Outdoors and Religion Columnists
- Relationships and Religion Columnists
- Religion News Columnists
- Religious Art Columnists
- Religious Events Columnists
- Religious Music and Entertainment Columnists
- Sports and Religion Columnists
- Style and Religion Columnists
- Technology and Religion Columnists
- Travel and Religion Columnists
- Women in Religion Columnists
Resource Library
- 2026 Calendar
- Library of World Religions
- The 100 Most Holy Places on Earth
- Patheos Answers
- Podcasts
- Videos
- Faith Leaders Database
- Anglican Episcopalian
- Bahai
- Baptist
- Buddhism
- Christianity
- Confucianism
- Eastern Orthodoxy
- Hinduism
- Holiness and Pentecostal
- ISKCON
- Islam
- Judaism
- Lutheran
- Methodist
- The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints
- New Age
- Paganism
- Presbytarian and Reformed
- Protestantism
- Religion Behind the Scenes
- Roman Catholic
- Scientology
- Shia Islam
- Sikhism
- Sufism
- Sunni Islam
- Taoism
- Zen
- See all religions
Research Tools
Ad-Free & Subscriber Log-In Subscription Support
Ad-Free & Subscriber Log-In Subscription Support
- Trending:
- Forgiveness
- |
- Marriage
- |
- Consciousness
- |
- Death Penalty
- |
- Election
- |
- Halloween
- Home
- General Christian
- Trinitarian Spirituality, 14: Putting Jesus on the “Outside” of God
Trinitarian Spirituality, 14: Putting Jesus on the “Outside” of God
Last updated on: October 17, 2012 at 4:16 pm by K. Mulhern
Trinitarian Spirituality, 14: Putting Jesus on the “Outside” of God 2012-10-17T16:16:31-06:00 K. Mulhern
Patheos Explore the world's faith through different perspectives on religion and spirituality! Patheos has the views of the prevalent religions and spiritualities of the world.
Is the Son “inside” of God or “outside” of God?
This seems to be the heart of the question when we think of Arius’ solution, and those that followed his line of thinking. Arius and his ilk read the gospels and saw the Son sent for us, which is true. At what point, though, was he sent? In fact, at what point was he begotten?
Just using the word “point” makes the point. It’s as though Arius and his friends put their finger on the historical Jesus Christ and traced him back – back and back and back to his beginning, his beginning in the will of God who “begat” him in order to create and redeem us. The “only begotten Son.” For us. Pro nobis.
If this is the way we understand Trinity—as a singular God who, well, diversified himself for the sake of creation—then we are far afield from the grand understanding that orthodoxy urges us to embrace. Let’s see how it “reduces” God, or in some other way diminishes his mystery and glory.
The first problem we encounter is with the name “Father” for God. If in fact, God became a Father when he produced his only-begotten Son, then there is a reality to God that is before Father, a reality to him that is not essentially Father. The Fatherhood of God becomes tangential to his true identity, and so our relationship with him is actually based on some aspect of his character rather than his essence. He is something other than Father.
Second problem: When we worship Jesus, are we actually worshiping someone or something less than God? And we think God is okay with that? “I will not yield my glory to another…” (Is. 48.11).
Third problem: If the Son has been created and has his origin in the will of God, then the Son cannot fully know the heart of God—“he cannot possess comprehensive knowledge of the one God, nor indeed of himself.” If the Son falls on this side of creation, then he shares to some degree our fundamental ignorance and inability to know God. His entire ministry among us as the lived man, Jesus Christ, is shot through and through with possibility and probability, but not certainty, not revelation, and not salvation.
Fourth problem: If God needed to beget someone in order to create and redeem, and his own presence is too transcendent for us to bear, then we cannot really know him, and we most certainly cannot have a genuine relationship with him. We are two steps removed from knowing God, and he remains inaccessible, unknowable, unapproachable. We weren’t, then, made for relationship with him, and we cannot understand salvation as union with the heart of God.
If, as Anatolios writes, “the attribute ‘unbegotten’ becomes the crucial description of the divine essence,” then the Son does not belong in the Godhead. He may be super, preexistent, full of divine power, but he is a channel of God’s presence, not God’s presence himself.
What kind of God does that leave us?
We now have a God who is far away, watching us from a distance (Bette Midler was right!), relying on a super-creature to accomplish divine purposes. We have a God whose heart is only a Father’s heart in its posture toward us, but has never revealed to us the fuller dimension of who he is. We have a God whose “salvation” is referential rather than personal; whose instrument of creation and redemption is his “special assistant” but not his dear and eternal Son.
And we have a Savior whose knowledge of God is limited, partial, and select; we have a Savior who shares our distance from God and whose ministry among us is appointed rather than chosen; we have a Savior whose love for us is instrumental rather than immediate; and we have a Savior who is “contingent,” a being whose very existence is subject to the divine will, which comes to him from the outside. And really, what would be the point of the incarnation?
Is this it? Is this the God we worship? What are our options? How else can we understand the Trinity, creation, unbegottenness, begottenness?
Note to Reader: This series on Trinitarian Spirituality explores the history and spirituality behind the shaping of the Nicene Creed using Khaled Anatolios’ Retrieving Nicaea: The Development and Meaning of Trinitarian Doctrine (Grand Rapids, MI: Baker Academic, 2011) as guide and inspiration. It’s best to begin at the beginning: An Introduction.
Trinitarian Spirituality: a series
Previous Post

June 20, 2012
Trinitarian Spirituality, 13: How Close Is Jesus to the Heart of God?
Next Post

July 10, 2012 Trinitarian Spirituality, 15: God from the Inside Out
Browse Our Archives
Select a Category Advent Ascetical Theology Book Reviews Children and Parenting Easter Epiphany Friends of God Lent Life in the Spirit Ludolph Pascalian Spirituality: a series Politics Prayers Six Neo-Christian Myths Spiritual Formation Tales from My Father Trinitarian Spirituality: a series Uncategorized
Select a Month October 2026 July 2024 June 2024 December 2023 August 2023 July 2023 June 2023 January 2023 October 2022 September 2022 August 2022 July 2022 April 2022 November 2021 October 2021 September 2021 August 2021 July 2021 June 2020 January 2020 December 2019 November 2019 October 2019 September 2019 June 2019 May 2019 April 2019 October 2018 August 2018 July 2018 June 2018 May 2018 April 2018 March 2018 February 2018 May 2017 April 2017 March 2017 February 2017 November 2016 June 2016 April 2016 February 2016 January 2016 December 2015 November 2015 October 2015 September 2015 August 2015 March 2015 October 2014 September 2014 August 2014 April 2014 March 2014 February 2014 September 2013 August 2013 July 2013 June 2013 May 2013 April 2013 March 2013 February 2013 January 2013 December 2012 November 2012 October 2012 September 2012 August 2012 July 2012 June 2012 May 2012 April 2012 March 2012 February 2012 October 2011 August 2011 July 2011 February 2011 October 2010 September 2010 July 2010 May 2010 April 2010 March 2010 February 2010 January 2010 November 2009 September 2009 August 2009 July 2009 June 2009
TAKE THE
Religious Wisdom Quiz
How many people boarded the ark with Noah?
Select your answer to see how you score.
Twelve Ten Eight Two
Related posts from Dry Bones
When Spiritual Growth Looks Like Losing Ground
From Virtue Signaling to Virtue
The Three Gifts and Their Meaning: a Ludolph...
The Sermon on the Mount for the New...
TRENDING AT PATHEOS General Christian
Seventy and Five Years Old: God Still Starts...
There is a small detail tucked into Genesis 12 that I skipped...
A Biblical Vision of Success in Christian Life...
The Concern and Quest Recent trends and tendencies I note around me...
Indigenous Peoples’ Day and the Church
Indigenous' Peoples Day or Columbus Day? Depending on where you live...
When Spiritual Growth Looks Like Losing Ground
Four Passive Spiritual Disciplines: An Introduction When I was a college freshman,...
Faith and Finding Your Current Season
“To everything there is a season,” Ecclesiastes tells us, “and a time...
Did Jesus Fear God's Wrath in Gethsemane?
That Time Jesus Was Terrified Before we begin, let me say at...
view all General Christian blogs
Ad-Free & Subscriber Log-In Subscription Support
- About Us
- 2026 Calendar
- Videos
- Podcasts
- Library of World Religions
- Faith In Media Tracker
- Advertise With Us
- Write for Us
- Privacy Policy
- Terms of Service
- Do Not Sell My Data
- Contact Us
- Radiant Digital
- Manage Newsletter Subscriptions
- Unsubscribe From Notifications
- Sitemap
Copyright 2008-2026, Patheos. All rights reserved.
Subscription Support Ad-Free & Subscriber Log-In











