{"id":84774,"date":"2024-07-08T12:45:03","date_gmt":"2024-07-08T16:45:03","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/?p=84774"},"modified":"2024-07-10T00:26:50","modified_gmt":"2024-07-10T04:26:50","slug":"1-esdras-trent-the-canon-james-swan","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/2024\/07\/1-esdras-trent-the-canon-james-swan.html","title":{"rendered":"1 Esdras, Trent, the Canon, & James Swan"},"content":{"rendered":"\n<\/head>
<\/a>
Photo Credit: 4th century Codex Vaticanus, from the Vatican Library, containing 1 Esdras 1:55-2:5 [public domain \/ Wikimedia Commons]<\/figcaption><\/figure>Anti-Catholic Reformed Protestant apologist James Swan is again<\/a> trying to make polemical and rhetorical hay out of a supposed dispute between myself and a fellow Catholic lay apologist; in this instance, my very good friend, Gary Michuta. He calls this post, \u201cWhy the Canon Is Closed According to Roman Catholic Apologists, and Why the Canon is Not Closed According to Roman Catholic Apologists<\/a>\u201d (3-14-12). Here is most of it:<\/p>\n
You can\u2019t make this stuff up:<\/p>\n
The Canon is closed:<\/p>\n
\u201cScripture was Scripture before the canon was declared. Vatican I and Vatican II both state this. The canon is not Scripture itself, but the authoritative list of biblical books. Thus, there is no difficulty in saying \u2018Scripture existed before the canon was declared.\u2019 Indeed, this was necessarily the case, since declaring a list of biblical books presupposes that there are biblical books to be listed! The point of the canon was to end dispute once and for all as to which books are part of the Bible, since some didn\u2019t accept various books, and others thought books were Scripture that were not (as later determined by councils and popes and general consensus).\u201d<\/p>\n\u201cI would say that many Christians largely knew what books were part of Scripture, but not exactly or with precision, and that\u2019s where the Church\u2019s declarations were important and necessary: to remove any remaining doubt and make it more certain what books were in the Bible.\u201d[source<\/a>] [a Facebook post of mine, dated 3-13-12]<\/p>\n
The canon is open:<\/p>\n
\u201cThe fourth question of the Capita Dubitationum<\/i> asked whether those books that were not included in Trent\u2019s list, but were included in the Latin Vulgate (e.g. The Book of Esdras, 4 Ezra, and 3 Maccabees), should be rejected by a Conciliar decree, or should they be passed over in silence. Only three Fathers voted for an explicit rejection. Forty-two voted that the status of these books should be passed over in silence. Eight bishops did not vote. The majority won, and Trent deliberately withheld any explicit decision on these books.<\/p>\n
\u2026The question of Esdras\u2019 canonical status was left theoretically open.\u201d [Gary Michuta,\u00a0Why Catholic Bibles are Bigger<\/i>\u00a0(Michigan: Grotto Press, 2007), pp. 240-241].<\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n
All that is required here is for me to further clarify that the books that were<\/em> declared by Trent certainly are part of the canon of Scripture (all doubt is removed about those<\/em>, for those who accept Catholic conciliar authority); and the books that were not<\/em> declared upon at all there (including [I] Esdras), are \u201ctheoretically open,\u201d as Gary put it. Since Gary is the leading Catholic apologist today on the topic of the canon, I gladly yield to his opinion. Having now done that, there is no contradiction between us, since we agree.\u00a0That said, it\u2019s a pretty minor textual issue that we\u2019re discussing with regard to Esdras, as will be seen when we examine it more closely.<\/p>\n
***<\/p>\n
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***<\/p>\n
Esdras is almost all simply a reiteration of parts of 2 Chronicles, Ezra, and Nehemiah. The great Protestant scholar F. F. Bruce gives it short shrift in his book, The Canon of Scripture<\/em> (Downers Grove, Illinois, InterVarsity Press, 1988, p. 47), describing it as \u201ca variant Greek edition of the history from 2 Chron. 35:1 to Neh. 8:13).\u201d Michuta adds: \u201cOnly a short section of this book (Esdras 3:1-5:6) contains unique material. Most of the book is a repetition of 2 Chronicles, Ezra, or Nehemiah\u201d (Ibid<\/em>., p. 239). Encyclopaedia Britannica<\/em> (\u201cFirst Book of Esdras\u201d<\/a>) summarizes more specifically:<\/p>\n
The work is textually more closely related to the Old Testament than other books of the Apocrypha, for it traces portions of Israel\u2019s history from 621\u00a0BC<\/span>\u00a0to 444\u00a0BC<\/span>\u00a0by summarizing II Chronicles 35:1\u201336:23, the whole of the\u00a0canonical\u00a0Book of Ezra, and\u00a0Nehemiah\u00a07:73\u20138:12.<\/p><\/blockquote>\n
So what is the nature of the unique portion?\u00a0 The same article opines:<\/p>\n
The only new material is the \u201cTale of the Three Guardsmen,\u201d a Persian folk story that was slightly altered to fit a Jewish context. The method used in compiling I Esdras is uncertain, especially because of numerous historical inconsistencies and errors; in several instances it also alters biblical texts.<\/p><\/blockquote>\n
We\u2019re talking about two chapters and six verses of a third (93 verses, about 2211 words, and about 2.8 pages in my RSV): that are different from other portions of the Old Testament agreed upon by all. Wikipedia (\u201c1 Esdras\u201d<\/a>) adds: \u201cMany Protestant and Catholic scholars assign no historical value to the sections of the book not duplicated in\u00a0Ezra\u2013Nehemiah.\u201d<\/p>\n
None of this information \u2014 predictably \u2013, was included in Swan\u2019s little potshot. It didn\u2019t fit the plan and goal, you see. If that\u2019s scholarly consensus today, it looks like Trent was right on the money almost 500 years ago, and acted wisely and correctly in passing over making a declaration about the canonicity of Esdras. Lastly, the Wikipedia article provides a handy summary of the overlap of Esdras and other books (I modified the order a bit):<\/p>\n
II Chr. 35 = I Esd. 1:1-33<\/p>\n
II Chr. 36 = I Esd. 1:34-58<\/p>\n
Ezr. 1 = I Esd. 2:1-14<\/p>\n
Ezr. 2 = I Esd. 5:7-46<\/p>\n
Ezr. 3 = I Esd. 5:47-65<\/p>\n
Ezr. 4:1-5 = I Esd. 5:66-73<\/p>\n
[Ezra 4:6 is not found in Esdras]<\/p>\n
Ezr. 4:7-24 = I Esd. 2:15-30a<\/p>\n
Ezr. 5 = I Esd. 6:1-22<\/p>\n
Ezr. 6 = I Esd. 6:23 \u2014 7<\/p>\n
Ezr. 7 = I Esd. 8:1-27<\/p>\n
Ezr. 8 = I Esd. 8:28-67<\/p>\n
Ezr. 9 = I Esd. 8:68-90<\/p>\n
Ezr. 10 = I Esd. 8:91-9:36<\/p>\n
Neh. 7:73-8:12 = I Esd. 9:37-55<\/p><\/blockquote>\n
Swan\u2019s post, seen in this light, is what Shakespeare described in Macbeth: \u201ca tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing.\u201d<\/p>\n
*<\/div>\n
***<\/div>\n
\n
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***\nPractical Matters<\/em><\/strong>: Perhaps some of my 4,600+ free online articles (the most comprehensive \u201cone-stop\u201d Catholic apologetics site) or\u00a0fifty-five books<\/a>\u00a0have helped you (by God\u2019s grace) to decide to\u00a0become Catholic<\/a>\u00a0or to\u00a0return to the Church<\/a>, or better understand some doctrines and\u00a0why<\/em>\u00a0we believe them<\/a>.<\/p>\nOr you may believe my work is worthy to support for the purpose of apologetics and evangelism in general. If so, please seriously consider a much-needed financial contribution. I\u2019m always in need of more funds: especially\u00a0monthly<\/em>\u00a0support. \u201cThe laborer is worthy of his wages\u201d (1 Tim 5:18, NKJV). 1 December 2021 was my 20th anniversary as a\u00a0full-time Catholic apologist<\/a>, and February 2022 marked the 25th anniversary of my blog.<\/p>\n
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\n*
\n***
***\n*<\/p>\nPhoto Credit<\/strong>: 4th century Codex Vaticanus, from the Vatican Library, containing 1 Esdras 1:55-2:5<\/span> [public domain \/ Wikimedia Commons<\/a>]<\/p>\n
Summary<\/em>: Anti-Catholic James Swan sez that I contradict fellow Catholic apologist & friend Gary Michuta on the canonicity of 1 Esdras. I don\u2019t, & it\u2019s a more complex issue, too, as I prove.<\/p>\n<\/div>\n
\u00a0<\/p>\n<\/body><\/html>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"
Anti-Catholic Reformed Protestant apologist James Swan is again trying to make polemical and rhetorical hay out of a supposed dispute between myself and a fellow Catholic lay apologist; in this instance, my very good friend, Gary Michuta. 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Formerly a campus missionary, as a Protestant, Dave was received into the Catholic Church in February 1991, by the late, well-known catechist and theologian, Fr. John A. Hardon, S. J. Dave\u2019s articles have appeared in many influential Catholic periodicals, including \\\"This Rock\\\" (now called \\\"Catholic Answers Magazine\\\"), \\\"Envoy Magazine\\\" (Patrick Madrid), \\\"The Catholic Answer,\\\" \\\"The Coming Home Journal,\\\" \\\"Gilbert Magazine\\\" (American Chesterton Society), and \\\"The Latin Mass.\\\" He also writes a featured column for every issue of \\\"The Michigan Catholic\\\": published by the archdiocese of Detroit, and was editor for most of the apologetics tracts published by the St. Paul Street Evangelization apostolate. Dave\u2019s apologetics and writing apostolate was the subject of a feature article in the May 2002 issue of \\\"Envoy Magazine.\\\" He served as the staff moderator at the Internet discussion forum for The Coming Home Network, from 2007-2010. Dave has been interviewed on many nationally syndicated Catholic radio shows, including \\\"Catholic Answers Live\\\" (twice), \\\"Faith and Family Live\\\" (Steve Wood), \\\"Kresta in the Afternoon,\\\" \\\"Son Rise Morning Show,\\\" \\\"Catholic Connection\\\" (Teresa Tomeo), and \\\"The Catholics Next Door.\\\" His large and popular website, \\\"Biblical Evidence for Catholicism,\\\" was online from March 1997 to March 2007, and received the 1998 Catholic Website of the Year award from \\\"Envoy Magazine.\\\" His blog of the same name (now transferred to Patheos), begun in February 2004, contains more than 1,500 papers, at least 500 debates or dialogues, and over 50 distinct \\\"index\\\" web pages. Unsolicited correspondence has indicated many hundreds of conversions (or returns) to the Catholic faith as a result, by God's grace, of these writings. Dave's conversion story was published in the bestselling book \\\"Surprised by Truth\\\" (edited by Patrick Madrid; San Diego: Basilica Press, 1994). Sophia Institute Press has published six of his books: \\\"A Biblical Defense of Catholicism\\\" (Foreword by Fr. John A. Hardon, S. J., 1996 \/ 2003), \\\"The Catholic Verses\\\" (2004), \\\"The One-Minute Apologist\\\" (2007), \\\"Bible Proofs for Catholic Truths\\\" (2009), \\\"The Quotable Newman\\\" (editor: 2012), and \\\"Proving the Catholic Faith is Biblical\\\" (2015). He is co-author (with Dr. Paul Thigpen) of the inserts for \\\"The New Catholic Answer Bible\\\" (Our Sunday Visitor: 2005), and editor for \\\"The Wisdom of Mr. Chesterton: The Very Best Quotes, Quips, and Cracks from the Pen of G. K. Chesterton\\\" (Saint Benedict Press \/ TAN Books: 2009). \\\"100 Biblical Arguments Against Sola Scriptura\\\" was published by Catholic Answers in May 2012. His \\\"Quotable Wesley\\\" compilation was published by (Protestant \/ Wesleyan publisher) Beacon Hill Press in April 2014. Several of his 49 books are bestsellers in their field. Dave maintains a popular personal Facebook page, a Facebook author page, and has a Twitter account as well. He offers almost all of his books in e-book form on his own Biblical Catholicism site (http:\/\/biblicalcatholicism.com\/), at a permanent deep discount: only $2.99 for ePub, mobi, and AZW, and $1.99 for PDF. His writing has been enthusiastically endorsed or recommended by many leading Catholic apologists, authors, and priests, including Dr. Scott Hahn, Fr. Peter M. J. Stravinskas, Marcus Grodi, Patrick Madrid, Steve Ray, Tim Staples, Devin Rose, Mike Aquilina, Al Kresta, Karl Keating, Fr. Dwight Longenecker, Brandon Vogt, Marcellino D'Ambrosio, and Fr. John A. Hardon, S. J. Dave has been happily married to his wife Judy since October 1984. They have three sons and a daughter, and reside in southeast Michigan (metro Detroit).\",\"sameAs\":[\"https:\/\/biblicalcatholicism.com\/\",\"https:\/\/www.facebook.com\/dave.armstrong.798\",\"https:\/\/www.youtube.com\/@LuxVeritatisApologetics\"],\"url\":\"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/author\/davearmstrong\"}]}<\/script>\n<!-- \/ Yoast SEO plugin. -->","yoast_head_json":{"title":"1 Esdras, Trent, the Canon, & James Swan","description":"Anti-Catholic James Swan sez that I contradict fellow Catholic apologist & friend Gary Michuta on the canonicity of 1 Esdras. 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Formerly a campus missionary, as a Protestant, Dave was received into the Catholic Church in February 1991, by the late, well-known catechist and theologian, Fr. John A. Hardon, S. J. Dave\u2019s articles have appeared in many influential Catholic periodicals, including \"This Rock\" (now called \"Catholic Answers Magazine\"), \"Envoy Magazine\" (Patrick Madrid), \"The Catholic Answer,\" \"The Coming Home Journal,\" \"Gilbert Magazine\" (American Chesterton Society), and \"The Latin Mass.\" He also writes a featured column for every issue of \"The Michigan Catholic\": published by the archdiocese of Detroit, and was editor for most of the apologetics tracts published by the St. Paul Street Evangelization apostolate. Dave\u2019s apologetics and writing apostolate was the subject of a feature article in the May 2002 issue of \"Envoy Magazine.\" He served as the staff moderator at the Internet discussion forum for The Coming Home Network, from 2007-2010. Dave has been interviewed on many nationally syndicated Catholic radio shows, including \"Catholic Answers Live\" (twice), \"Faith and Family Live\" (Steve Wood), \"Kresta in the Afternoon,\" \"Son Rise Morning Show,\" \"Catholic Connection\" (Teresa Tomeo), and \"The Catholics Next Door.\" His large and popular website, \"Biblical Evidence for Catholicism,\" was online from March 1997 to March 2007, and received the 1998 Catholic Website of the Year award from \"Envoy Magazine.\" His blog of the same name (now transferred to Patheos), begun in February 2004, contains more than 1,500 papers, at least 500 debates or dialogues, and over 50 distinct \"index\" web pages. Unsolicited correspondence has indicated many hundreds of conversions (or returns) to the Catholic faith as a result, by God's grace, of these writings. Dave's conversion story was published in the bestselling book \"Surprised by Truth\" (edited by Patrick Madrid; San Diego: Basilica Press, 1994). Sophia Institute Press has published six of his books: \"A Biblical Defense of Catholicism\" (Foreword by Fr. John A. Hardon, S. J., 1996 \/ 2003), \"The Catholic Verses\" (2004), \"The One-Minute Apologist\" (2007), \"Bible Proofs for Catholic Truths\" (2009), \"The Quotable Newman\" (editor: 2012), and \"Proving the Catholic Faith is Biblical\" (2015). He is co-author (with Dr. Paul Thigpen) of the inserts for \"The New Catholic Answer Bible\" (Our Sunday Visitor: 2005), and editor for \"The Wisdom of Mr. Chesterton: The Very Best Quotes, Quips, and Cracks from the Pen of G. K. Chesterton\" (Saint Benedict Press \/ TAN Books: 2009). \"100 Biblical Arguments Against Sola Scriptura\" was published by Catholic Answers in May 2012. His \"Quotable Wesley\" compilation was published by (Protestant \/ Wesleyan publisher) Beacon Hill Press in April 2014. Several of his 49 books are bestsellers in their field. Dave maintains a popular personal Facebook page, a Facebook author page, and has a Twitter account as well. He offers almost all of his books in e-book form on his own Biblical Catholicism site (http:\/\/biblicalcatholicism.com\/), at a permanent deep discount: only $2.99 for ePub, mobi, and AZW, and $1.99 for PDF. His writing has been enthusiastically endorsed or recommended by many leading Catholic apologists, authors, and priests, including Dr. Scott Hahn, Fr. Peter M. J. Stravinskas, Marcus Grodi, Patrick Madrid, Steve Ray, Tim Staples, Devin Rose, Mike Aquilina, Al Kresta, Karl Keating, Fr. Dwight Longenecker, Brandon Vogt, Marcellino D'Ambrosio, and Fr. John A. Hardon, S. J. Dave has been happily married to his wife Judy since October 1984. They have three sons and a daughter, and reside in southeast Michigan (metro Detroit).","sameAs":["https:\/\/biblicalcatholicism.com\/","https:\/\/www.facebook.com\/dave.armstrong.798","https:\/\/www.youtube.com\/@LuxVeritatisApologetics"],"url":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/author\/davearmstrong"}]}},"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/84774","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/2331"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=84774"}],"version-history":[{"count":0,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/84774\/revisions"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/84777"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=84774"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=84774"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.patheos.com\/blogs\/davearmstrong\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=84774"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}