Dialogue with Tom Wright about History and Eschatology— Part Two

Last updated on: November 12, 2019 at 1:48 am by Ben Witherington

Dialogue with Tom Wright about History and Eschatology— Part Two 2019-09-17T17:53:26-04:00 Ben Witherington

LOGO Patheos Explore the world's faith through different perspectives on religion and spirituality! Patheos has the views of the prevalent religions and spiritualities of the world.

BEN: One of the real strengths of this book is that you are able to chronicle the intellectual history from ancient Epicureanism to the present and show how the dominant world view today is not much different from ancient Epicureanism in the way it brackets out God and ‘the supernatural’ from history and ‘natural causation’. Since most of our audience will associate Epicureanism with hedonism, the pleasures of the palate and the flesh, explain what you mean by Epicureanism, and how it still informs modern presuppositions about the nature of the world.

TOM: Ancient Epicureanism was indeed known – by its opponents at least! – as hedonism. This, however, was at least in part a slur, since the serious Epicureans (represented by Lucretius) knew that over-indulgence in fleshly pleasures was counter-productive. They recommended a cooler, more detached pursuit of pleasure. But Epicureanism was far more than a charter for pleasure, whether licentious or restrained. It was a worldview, competing with Stoicism and the various forms of Platonism – as it still does. Stoicism saw the gods and the world as bundled up together in various kinds of pantheistic mix; Epicureanism saw the gods as completely detached from our world (though made ultimately of the same stuff), so that the gods don’t interfere in our world and nothing we can do will affect them. Since there is no divine action in the world, the world ‘makes itself’ through the random movement of atoms, which sometimes ‘swerve’ and, bumping into one another, produce different forms of life. This is the direct ancestor of modern evolutionism (not the biological theory of evolution, but the worldview which preceded it by a century or more on the a priori assumption that, with God or the gods absent from the world, the world must proceed under its own steam). ‘Epicureanism’ is therefore at the root a theory about how the world works; a theory which allows for the existence of the gods but which insists that they are not involved in our world, nor we in theirs.

Hedonism – in whatever form – is therefore the only proper motivation for action, since nothing we can do will either impress or affect the gods, and since when we die our atoms simply dissolve, so that, in the famous phrase, at death there is ‘nothing to be afraid of’. As Catherine Wilson comments in her book on Epicureanism at the origins of the Enlightenment, the ancient philosophy sounds remarkably familiar because it is in fact what most modern westerners implicitly believe. The real tragedy is that so many modern Christians have responded, not by re-inhabiting the biblical worldview, but by reaching for forms of Platonism (including the word ‘supernatural’ in its modern sense of divine ‘intervention’!) to bridge the gap between our world and God’s world. How much better to explore the biblical notion of the Temple, and the promise – not that we will eventually dwell with God, but that God will eventually dwell with us, setting up his kingdom ‘on earth as in heaven’. The Platonist would be shocked: that’s a category mistake, and an unwelcome one at that. The Stoic would be puzzled: surely God’s world and the human world already intersected completely (ignoring the problem of evil, of course). The Epicurean would find the idea of God’s kingdom arriving on earth both tasteless, tactless and thoroughly inconvenient. One might have to start sharing one’s favorite wine with those lower-class people down the road . . . Jesus would be delighted, having already turned the local water into even better wine, but always ready to accept another bottle or two from unexpected sources . . .

Uncategorized

Previous Post

November 11, 2019

Dialogue with Tom Wright about History and Eschatology-- Part One

Next Post

November 13, 2019 Dialogue with NT Wright about History and Eschatology-- Part Three

Browse Our Archives

Select a Category Uncategorized

Select a Month October 2026 September 2026 August 2026 July 2026 June 2026 May 2026 April 2026 March 2026 February 2026 January 2026 December 2025 November 2025 October 2025 September 2025 August 2025 July 2025 June 2025 May 2025 April 2025 March 2025 February 2025 January 2025 December 2024 November 2024 October 2024 September 2024 August 2024 July 2024 June 2024 May 2024 April 2024 March 2024 February 2024 January 2024 December 2023 November 2023 October 2023 September 2023 August 2023 July 2023 June 2023 May 2023 April 2023 March 2023 February 2023 January 2023 December 2022 November 2022 October 2022 September 2022 August 2022 July 2022 June 2022 May 2022 April 2022 March 2022 February 2022 January 2022 December 2021 November 2021 October 2021 September 2021 August 2021 July 2021 June 2021 May 2021 April 2021 March 2021 February 2021 January 2021 December 2020 November 2020 October 2020 September 2020 August 2020 July 2020 June 2020 May 2020 April 2020 March 2020 February 2020 January 2020 December 2019 November 2019 October 2019 September 2019 August 2019 July 2019 June 2019 May 2019 April 2019 March 2019 February 2019 January 2019 December 2018 November 2018 October 2018 September 2018 August 2018 July 2018 June 2018 May 2018 April 2018 March 2018 February 2018 January 2018 December 2017 November 2017 October 2017 September 2017 August 2017 July 2017 June 2017 May 2017 April 2017 March 2017 February 2017 January 2017 December 2016 November 2016 October 2016 September 2016 August 2016 July 2016 June 2016 May 2016 April 2016 March 2016 February 2016 January 2016 December 2015 November 2015 October 2015 September 2015 August 2015 July 2015 June 2015 May 2015 April 2015 March 2015 February 2015 January 2015 December 2014 November 2014 October 2014 September 2014 August 2014 July 2014 June 2014 May 2014 April 2014 March 2014 February 2014 January 2014 December 2013 November 2013 October 2013 September 2013 August 2013 July 2013 June 2013 May 2013 April 2013 March 2013 February 2013 January 2013 December 2012 November 2012 October 2012 September 2012 August 2012 July 2012 June 2012 May 2012 April 2012 March 2012 February 2012 January 2012 December 2011 November 2011 October 2011 September 2011 August 2011 July 2011 June 2011 May 2011 April 2011 March 2011 February 2011 January 2011

TAKE THE

Religious Wisdom Quiz